Groundspeak Portal

OK, I am really confused and hope I have not violated the rules of the Waymarking site. I just had a Waymark declined (in Figurative Public Sculpture) because "I have too many and should keep it to my 10 favorites." [I'm not trying to pick on one category -but this is the category who sent me the reason for that denial.] There are probably millions of statues in the US, and many, many more world-wide (ever been to France?), so how do I know what will be my top 10? And I am sure that over the past year, I've already done more than 10 figurative public sculptures because I like artwork and statues.

Is not the goal to submit and visit as many credible Waymarks within the guidelines of each category as possible? I just looked at the FPS category and my name was not the only one in a stream of posted Waymarkers. Am I totally missing the point? I just came off a one week working vacation and was trying to get the Waymarks done for other to enjoy. I really don't want to tick anyone off, but I also like to complete Waymarks. Nor do I know who sent the 'decline' so I don't know who to speak to directly. I did resubmit the Waymark with these comments. Trying not to whine, but feeling reaaaalllly confused.

Help,
Sandy

No it does not make any sense.  It is not like there is a shortage of figurative sculptures.  I believe that is a change to the category description and don't believe it was there at the time of the vote. And if the group wishes to enforce this then it will just go on my ignore list.

This 'limit of 10' was not there before because this is one of my favorite categories to waymark. It is an odd new 'limitation' since who cares if 'someone' is posting many. I don't complete waymarks for numbers (posted and visited). I post them to share with others. I also don't generally cross-post that much. Often, my dual posts (dual categories) is becasue a category owner asked me to submit to their category. I wonder what is really driving this limitation change?

I didn't know as a category Officer (Colorado Historical Markers) I could just change the rules willy-nilly. Silverquill was one of my categories founding Officers and really helped me create a fun and useful category description. To any and all--you can post as many credible Colorado Historical Markers as you wish!!

Take care,
Sandy

What an odd stance for a Category/Group to take.  I have over 100 entries in "Ontario Historic Plaques" (and about 40 in reserve... watch out Jake) and about 5 other categories I am 20+ in.

 

I see no reason to not encourage people to make as many as they like.

 

BQ

I dont get this stance. The world is huge and it's not like there's a handfull of waymarkers. So if BruceS went to Buenos Aires tomorrow, he wouldnt be able to get any figurative sculptures (even though Argentina has 0 waymarks)

Imagine if every group had a cap, there'd be 10,000 waymarks instead of 100,000. Also BurceS wouldnt have the coveted white ribbon.

saopaulo1:

I dont get this stance. The world is huge and it's not like there's a handfull of waymarkers. So if BruceS went to Buenos Aires tomorrow, he wouldnt be able to get any figurative sculptures (even though Argentina has 0 waymarks)

Imagine if every group had a cap, there'd be 10,000 waymarks instead of 100,000. Also BurceS wouldnt have the coveted white ribbon.

I could probably go to Sao Paulo and find several for the category even though Saopaulo1 has several in the category.  I can think of only one town where I have a waymark in this category that I am pretty sure there isn't another one available for the category in the town.  Damn Wind by JR Eason - Ovando, Montana
Now Ovando only has a population of only 71 people and I have waymarked the only sculpture in town but that is not to say there might be a new sculpture there now.

I also dont understand this part: "Also if the waymark can be listed in another category, that is where it belongs first." So you cant list the Statue of Liberty because it's on the NRHP and UNESCO's World Heritage and an Official Tourist Attraction. The three category mention have no relevance to artwork.

Maybe a new category needs to be started, maybe something like:

Unlimited Figurative Public Sculpture

Expanded Description: To keep this category fun for all,  you are encouraged to submit all sculptures which meet the qualification of figurative listed below.  Cross posting of waymarks is encouraged as this gives greater exposure of the sculptures.   The limitation is that you can only have 1 waymark visible in the other figurative sculpture category, if you have more make them invisible. That one waymark can be crossposted to this category.

Figurative sculpture is sculpture that is based on the human or animal figure, but NOT that of any one particular human or animal. (example: A statue of a little girl holding a basket would fit, a statue of a young Helen Keller holding a basket would not.) It may be fully representational or a partially abstracted piece, however, the figure must be recognizable as human or animal. (Representational means that the sculpture is made to look just like a person or animal would look. You could imagine seeing a similar person walking down the street. Abstracted means that you can tell it's a human/animal form, however it's not like any human/animal you'd see strutting down the street.)

Why make waymarks 'invisible?' Does that not make waymarking obsolete? Is not the charter of Waymarking to 'make the invisible visible' (things you may not have noticed. I think the limitation or 10 is not in the spirit of waymarking and needs to be removed. To whom should we speak about this?

Cross-Listing is one of the strengths of Waymarking.

Listings should only be made invisible for maintenance reasons.

 

Arbitrary rules that limit people and their ability to contribute are detrimental to Waymarking.

 

BQ

Outspoken1:

Why make waymarks 'invisible?' Does that not make waymarking obsolete? Is not the charter of Waymarking to 'make the invisible visible' (things you may not have noticed. I think the limitation or 10 is not in the spirit of waymarking and needs to be removed. To whom should we speak about this?

I was suggesting making the "old waymarks" in the "old category" invisible and resubmitting them in the new proposed Unlimited category. My real feeling is that the old category should remove the restriction then a new category would not be needed.

How the proposed new category should have read is something like

Unlimited Figurative Public Sculpture

Expanded Description: To keep this category fun for all,  you are encouraged to submit all sculptures which meet the qualification of figurative listed below.  Cross posting of waymarks is encouraged as this gives greater exposure of the sculptures.   The limitation is that you can only have 1 waymark visible in the "OLD" figurative sculpture category, if you have more make them invisible. That one waymark can be crossposted to this category.

Figurative sculpture is sculpture that is based on the human or animal figure, but NOT that of any one particular human or animal. (example: A statue of a little girl holding a basket would fit, a statue of a young Helen Keller holding a basket would not.) It may be fully representational or a partially abstracted piece, however, the figure must be recognizable as human or animal. (Representational means that the sculpture is made to look just like a person or animal would look. You could imagine seeing a similar person walking down the street. Abstracted means that you can tell it's a human/animal form, however it's not like any human/animal you'd see strutting down the street.)

Like I said the new category should not be needed.... the old one needs to lift the restriction or the new one will be needed.

saopaulo1:

I also dont understand this part: "Also if the waymark can be listed in another category, that is where it belongs first."

What if that other category also has the same restriction?

the blue quasar:

 

Arbitrary rules that limit people and their ability to contribute are detrimental to Waymarking.

 

BQ

Well said.   Period.    BruceS, I hope you are kidding about another cat, invisible, etc etc.   And who the *#&$ is going to police this?   NO.  ABSOLUTELY NO.   (imho)....  

Fishingwishing

fishingwishing:

the blue quasar:

 

Arbitrary rules that limit people and their ability to contribute are detrimental to Waymarking.

 

BQ

Well said.   Period.    BruceS, I hope you are kidding about another cat, invisible, etc etc.   And who the *#&$ is going to police this?   NO.  ABSOLUTELY NO.   (imho)....  

Fishingwishing

As I have said a new category should not be necessary but if an existing category does not allow active waymarkers to participate then.....  

duplicate

I have personally written to one of the officers - perhaps a gentle suggestion via email to the group officers can persuade them to rethink and rewrite the cat requirements.   We're all adults here, aren't we?  I will give them the benefit of the doubt that they felt this would be a good way to preserve the quality of their category.  And I would hope that they would be receptive to some positive constructive criticism.  

Silly.  The only thing that I can think of is they don't want to review that many waymarks.  If that's the case, they need to recruit more officers to handle the waymarks.  I started the "Abstract Public Sculpture" category and it is a bit of a pain because its popular and there are so many waymarks to review, however my whole goal with that category was to catalog and share sculpture and limiting it to 10 works per waymarker works against that.  If you don't want to deal with the reviewing then you need to either quit or get more reviewers.

Someone needs to invite the officers to participate in this thread.

 

I did resubmit my denied waymark to Fig Pub Scup with my concerns in the private message box. I don't know who denied me so I didn't know who directly to send it (resubmission) to. I will send an email to the leader of FPS as soon as I complete this post. I'm not trying to engage on a crusade - I just am totally lost with this limitation.

Hikenutty - I love and often participate in the Abstract Sculpture category. While I do not have formal art training, if you like, I would be please to submit my name to your category for officer to I can help with the approval process. Just let me know. I have not noticed significant lag time in your approval process.

One of the Figurative Public Sculptures Officers assured me that the language 'suggesting' that Waymarkers limit their submissions has been in the category since its inception.... and there have never really been any problems.  It's not a hard and fast rule, and I can only imagine your Waymark being denied as the work of an over-zealous reviewer.  

Outspoken1, I hope your resubmission is approved and this thread can be put to rest once and for all.

But the problem is not getting one of my waymarks approved. I have had that happen before. Sometimes the waymark belongs in a different category; sometimes there is not a category for it. That I understand.

What the 'Top 10" limit does is both close a category to waymarkers and force waymarkers to use a 'crystal ball' to figure out which are the 'Top 10' by 'knowing' what you will find in the future.

So as it stands, I can NEVER post another waymark to figurative public sculpture. I am over the 'Top 10' limit. But so are many others, including some of the Officers of Figurative Public Scuplture. I don't post to 'get numbers'. I post to share fantastic art that I have found. The City of THornton (my hometown) has asked me to post their public art. Oops! No can do. I'm over the limit and there is more Thornton art.

Again, this limitation is contraindicated to the theme of 'Waymarking: A Scavanger Hunt for Unique and Interesting Locations in the World (copies from the Title line on my web browser).

So how does the categogy become open again to waymarkers who have more than 10 waymarks?

So here is an interesting email I received in regards to a waymark I posted last night (http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM43DK). The approver of that waymark asked me to cross-post in Statues of Historic Figures (which I did).

--------------------
Dear Tom:

RE: "I see you did cross post.

Tom
GA Cacher"

First, it is not illegal to cross-post. In fact it is encouraged.

However, the real key is I was asked to cross-post this by an officer (approver) from Civil Rights Memorial category. As I said, I generally cross-post only if asked. I try to take quite a bit of time to do a thorough waymark (if possible) and cross-posting is time consuming.

Take care, Sandy
---------------------

Could the person who approved my Civil Rights Memorial and asked me to cross-post in Statues of Historic Figures to let Tom know that I was asked to do this (tom.gacacher@gmail.com).

(Yes, I just looked and saw that Tom is an Officer of Figurative Public Sculpture)

Thanks, Sandy

As you've posted this thread under Features and Functions as well, I kind of got lost in where it was.

http://portal.groundspeak.com/forums/thread/14655.aspx

Anyway, opinionate said "Yes, I agree this is beyond bad manners and not at all within the spirit of waymarking. Someone should point the leader to this thread if they have not already."

I sent an email to caverspencer on the 2nd, but haven't received a reply yet. caverspencer was last logged on the 3rd. Can't be bothered I guess.

One other thing Outspoken1 et al,

feel free to post any neon you find http://www.waymarking.com/cat/details.aspx?f=1&guid=e5e13bbe-6d70-4cf0-b97b-664ccfde1e07&exp=True

the blue quasar:

What an odd stance for a Category/Group to take.  I have over 100 entries in "Ontario Historic Plaques" (and about 40 in reserve... watch out Jake) and about 5 other categories I am 20+ in.
I see no reason to not encourage people to make as many as they like. 

BQ

Thanx for the warning "Blue Q" The Category will now be changed to a maximum of 100 Waymarks (or better yet 10) as there aren't  that many in "On tear rare e oh" to waymark.

Outspoken1:

So here is an interesting email I received in regards to a waymark I posted last night (http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM43DK). The approver of that waymark asked me to cross-post in Statues of Historic Figures (which I did).

--------------------
Dear Tom:

RE: "I see you did cross post.

Tom
GA Cacher"

First, it is not illegal to cross-post. In fact it is encouraged.

However, the real key is I was asked to cross-post this by an officer (approver) from Civil Rights Memorial category. As I said, I generally cross-post only if asked. I try to take quite a bit of time to do a thorough waymark (if possible) and cross-posting is time consuming.

Take care, Sandy
---------------------

Could the person who approved my Civil Rights Memorial and asked me to cross-post in Statues of Historic Figures to let Tom know that I was asked to do this (tom.gacacher@gmail.com).

(Yes, I just looked and saw that Tom is an Officer of Figurative Public Sculpture)

Thanks, Sandy

Yes I asked you to cross post and the e-mail you referenced was on the approval of your waymark in in the figurative cat. I meant it to say I see you decided to cross post to this cat as I suggested, thank you. As I am a offficer in both groups.

Also the Figurative leader took out the asking to limit to 10 the amount to post as I and another officer never checkes or cared to check how many people have listed in the cat! THe more the merrier!