Groundspeak Portal

Ok, I've been geocaching for about a year and a half and have over 500 finds.  I enjoy virtual caches and thought I understood why they were moved to waymarking.  That is, until I started looking at some of the local waymarks.  How is this a gps hunting game?  I understand the virtual caches taking me to coords, then asking me to verify my visit by providing a photo and descritption, and some information that can only be found at the site, like an artists name, or height of a totem pole, or something like that.  Most of the waymarks I looked at I could get to without gps as they show the map, a photo of the object in question, and simply ask for a photo and description.  Geez, I can do that for darn near all the local waymarks without getting out of my car.  It seems to me that posters missed the idea.  Shouldn't these be like virtual caches where you have to acutally learn something about the site you're taken to?  And what's with the same waymark showing up in 4 categories?  Can we just pick one place and maybe assign multiple categories?  You can find the same thing and log it 3 or 4 times.  Maybe there are more virtual cache type waymarks out there, but I'm thinking I'm not gonna bother looking.  I'm glad you all enjoy the sport, but it just isn't for me.  I'll stick with geocaching.  Thanks for letting me rant.

I hope you will return for an honest answer and aren't just trolling and running.

-cachemonkey-:

Ok, I've been geocaching for about a year and a half and have over 500 finds.  I enjoy virtual caches and thought I understood why they were moved to waymarking.  That is, until I started looking at some of the local waymarks.  How is this a gps hunting game?  I understand the virtual caches taking me to coords, then asking me to verify my visit by providing a photo and descritption, and some information that can only be found at the site, like an artists name, or height of a totem pole, or something like that.  Most of the waymarks I looked at I could get to without gps as they show the map, a photo of the object in question, and simply ask for a photo and description.  Geez, I can do that for darn near all the local waymarks without getting out of my car.

Some ask for nothing but a photo, some ask for more.  The point of gathering info from a virtual was to verify you were there.  Here, a photo acts as your proof.  I do see an issue where someone might not have a camera, but other than that, I don't see the problem.

As for using the map, I have 16 virtual geocache finds, and only with one did I use my GPS.  So while you may argue that's a problem, virtuals were no different.

It seems to me that posters missed the idea.  Shouldn't these be like virtual caches where you have to acutally learn something about the site you're taken to?

I've learned something about everyone I've posted and logged.  Just because I don't have to send it to the owner doesn't mean I don't learn something.  Similarly, when caching, I get something out of the entire hike, not just the cache location.  You're focused on "What's the minimum I have to do to get a smiley?"

And what's with the same waymark showing up in 4 categories?  Can we just pick one place and maybe assign multiple categories?  You can find the same thing and log it 3 or 4 times.

Some waymarks fit more than one category.  If I'm interested in finding historical churches, the site won't do me much good if someone waymarks a church under Unique Steeples and nothing else.  Logging things is only one aspect of waymarking.  The site is also intended to actually be useful.

Maybe there are more virtual cache type waymarks out there, but I'm thinking I'm not gonna bother looking.  I'm glad you all enjoy the sport, but it just isn't for me.  I'll stick with geocaching. 

Okay.

Thanks for letting me rant.

Like I said, I hope you come back for the answers rather than throwing a bunch of forum grafitti at people who are enjoying the game with no intention of returning.

You're focused on "What's the minimum I have to do to get a smiley?"

Truer words were never spoken, and there does seem to be a predominance of this opinion in the Community.   The old adage, "you get out of it, what you put into it", is true for Waymarking, Geocaching, and Wherigo.  I'm not usually focused on the numbers so much, although it is fun to read about the Mega Players out there like BruceS ,CCCooper, and Team Alamo, but I rather focus on a handful of Categories that I've found interesting to pursue.  Occassionaly I find a feature that piques my interest, but can't for the world figure out what Category to put it in (like the whalebone sidewalk I  saw a couple of days ago).

I appreciate the fact that there's multiple flavors to choose from, just like there is a variety of caches to hunt.

 

touchstone:

You're focused on "What's the minimum I have to do to get a smiley?"

Truer words were never spoken, and there does seem to be a predominance of this opinion in the Community.   The old adage, "you get out of it, what you put into it", is true for Waymarking, Geocaching, and Wherigo.  I'm not usually focused on the numbers so much, although it is fun to read about the Mega Players out there like BruceS ,CCCooper, and Team Alamo, but I rather focus on a handful of Categories that I've found interesting to pursue.  Occassionaly I find a feature that piques my interest, but can't for the world figure out what Category to put it in (like the whalebone sidewalk I  saw a couple of days ago).

I appreciate the fact that there's multiple flavors to choose from, just like there is a variety of caches to hunt.

I didn't realize I was any kind of mega player (If you check I also focus my effort in a few categories also) but I agree with the old adage, "you get out of it what you put in to it".   Waymarking does take a different mindset than Geocaching, for some that mindset comes easily and others it doesn't and may not come at all.  As for the OP saying the Waymark posters didn't get the idea, no it was he who did not understand Waymarking.  Different game, different rules, and different mindset.

darn duplicate posts :D

Waymarking is the "Show Me" game.  Yes, it is what you put in, and what others put into it too.  A good description that provides information about the location makes the visit more worthwhile.

Same is true in Geocaching, and to view Geocaching as a place where people only put keyholders inside lampost skirts would not be accurate either.

There is good and bad in all things, and I'm sorry to say that the reverance shown to Virtuals just escapes me.  In the same way that searching for a film canister in a guardrail seems to appeal to some more than seeing something beautiful or educational.

 

Some also believe that looking for this

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=7d01e956-ebc6-46d0-ba03-d26a0c0d9c15

is somehow better than this

http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WMN54

 

Funny, to me they are the same thing... just the second one has been catagorized.  I still learned the same info though.

BQ

the blue quasar:

There is good and bad in all things, and I'm sorry to say that the reverance shown to Virtuals just escapes me.  In the same way that searching for a film canister in a guardrail seems to appeal to some more than seeing something beautiful or educational.

Well said BQ.  But I think "good or bad" is a matter of taste.  Some people like Chardonnay, some like Zinfandel, some don't like wine at all....and (I can't resist) some whine all the time.

What is the point of stating 'this sport is not for me' in a forum?  An open mind would ask what's in this activity for me.

-cachemonkey-:

Shouldn't these be like virtual caches where you have to acutally learn something about the site you're taken to? 

 

I've actually learned far more from the sites I've visited while Waymarking as compared to virtual caches.  When I would find virtuals I would find the sign, skim it for the required information, and leave.  With Waymarking I spend much more time researching a location that I'm adding, and when I visit, I'm more inclined to spend some time reading the information in the area and looking around.  I guess I just don't need anyone to spoon feed me questions to feel like I've learned something.  Besides, virtuals often ask for information that can't be found online.  Say, like "What is the serial number of the sign?" or "When was this plaque placed?"  How is that learning anything?

the blue quasar:

Some also believe that looking for this

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=7d01e956-ebc6-46d0-ba03-d26a0c0d9c15

is somehow better than this

http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WMN54

 

Funny, to me they are the same thing... just the second one has been catagorized.  I still learned the same info though.

Ya know, that brings up a good point about the educational value.  With Waymarking I can learn about places that I'll never be able to visit.  When a virtual gives vague descriptions, and no pictures, I'll never learn anything since I can't physically be there.  With Waymarking I can look at photos, read the detailed description, and I know the name of the place so I can research more if I choose even if the location is 1/2 way around the world.

I signed up for Waymarking in the UK recently as an additional interest to Geocaching and I do agree that it is not how I thought it would be and was slightly disappointed that non of my way marks were found as a new cache would be.

But now having realised that the point is to find and log way marks for your own satisfaction and just maybe interest other waymarkers.

At the moment I am concentrating on Cut Bench Marks, and OS Trig Points. The Cut Bench Marks are on most of our old Churches and I do agree that I could list most of our Churches under maybe four or five categories but as there are fewer Waymarkers in the UK there is plenty of time for this.

As for the reason to look at way marks seems to be a thing you can’t understand, check my Waymark WM496M and you will find a fact you may not have known, or may not be interested in, and this is how it works. This Waymark is close to our home along with many historic places of interest.

It must sometimes be difficult to locate something new of interest if there are so many way markers jumping on every category listed in your own area but as with caching, I look at every new listing of mine as a FTF.

I don’t really know whether you will come back and check your post but it gives me a chance to put my perspective over, so thanks for that.

I dont know if cachemonkey will come back to see these replys but here is mine.

I am enjoying WP. Yes I liked the virtual from GC.com because it allowed for sharing a location even if you couldnt place a physical cache. I dont cache for the numbers so I dont need the millions of keyboxes on guard rails that offer nothing else but a smiley. I enjoy the time I spend roaming through the woods or over a trail but I also like seeing things that add to my book of knowledge that I may not have known. Sure you can log many of these & never leave your house but then why do it? It isnt the game that is lacking it is the person. It is what you make it.

Im going on vacation next wk & I have spent hours here looking for places to go to see things that I wouldnt see otherwise. A bell shaped streetlight, a whale mural on a bank by Wyland, a beautiful fountain in a garden or a unobstructed view of the harbor from a rooftop. Each 1 of these locations will be the 1st step in finding other things of interest in that area. Isnt that what its all about? It is for me. So its great to have different types of 'games' because each person has different types of interests. MW

Lately I've heard a few encouraging comments from my geocaching friends.

This would be better as a Waymark.  Finding a film can in a bush along the wall is not what I was brought here to see.  The Buddhist Temple is the attraction here.

When I'm going on holidays, you bet I look at the local Waymarks cause they show me what there is to see in the area.

Many others have openly told me that they often go onto the Waymarking site to see the images from around the area, they just don't want to participate in the game part of it.  That's fine to me, and some have started Waymarking because they've seen some good photos and listings and said "Hey, I can do that".  This is escpecially true of those that enjoy photography, because even though Flickr/Photobucket are great for storing images people are starting to say that they want to be able to do more.  That's where Waymarking has them beat hands down!

BQ

I have questions similar to cachemonkey..   mainly, what is the point of some of the waymark entries?  

I did a simple search for waymarks around my zip code, and the first two waymarks were a Animal Clinic, and a McDonalds in Renton, WA

what the heck is so interesting as those locations?  granted, I didn't dig deeper to find out why they were listed, but it seems either

a. people are just entering waymarks to any old thing, for what purpose, I am not sure (get their waymark counts up?)

or

b. there is just something I am not understanding about this activity.. like is it trying to take over for the yellow pages?


so I guess I have to ask as the OP did..   what's the point?  or more specifically, why are people logging waymarks of McDonalds in Renton?

robdogg:

I have questions similar to cachemonkey..   mainly, what is the point of some of the waymark entries?  

I did a simple search for waymarks around my zip code, and the first two waymarks were a Animal Clinic, and a McDonalds in Renton, WA

what the heck is so interesting as those locations?  granted, I didn't dig deeper to find out why they were listed, but it seems either

a. people are just entering waymarks to any old thing, for what purpose, I am not sure (get their waymark counts up?)

or

b. there is just something I am not understanding about this activity.. like is it trying to take over for the yellow pages?


so I guess I have to ask as the OP did..   what's the point?  or more specifically, why are people logging waymarks of McDonalds in Renton?

I view the McDonald's as starter waymarks.  Many people post a waymark for McDonald's early on as they are fairly easy to do, they can get the feel of how the site works etc.   I personally do not really like most commercial categories but I do post one waymark in the category.  One thing about waymarking is that any category you don't like just put it on your ignore list and you won't see them again.  One could ask why do so many geocachers hide and find LPC or guardrail caches which are probably a much higher percentage of caches than all the chain restaurant waymarks are of all waymarks.  All chain restaurants make up just over 4% of all waymarks and McDonald's specifically only make up 1.2% of all waymarks.  So if youdon't like chains ignore them you will only be missing 4% so go after the other 96%.

It could simply be a laziness thing. Those who waymark in your area, if there are any regulars, may not want to bother to do research for a category such as National Register of Historic Places. That category requires you to find potential buildings from a list then write up a nice description on them. Me personally, it usually takes an hour, sometimes more, for me to do the proper research and write-up for a waymark in this category. Whereas doing a fast food chain waymark takes only a couple minutes. It's the equivalent of doing a parking lot micro vs. a 2-mile hike in the woods.

Rayman:

It's the equivalent of doing a parking lot micro vs. a 2-mile hike in the woods.

Wise words!

There are detailed entries with lots of research, and there are quickies for the numbers.  Both games have the options to create your own experience.  Only Waymarking though lets to filter out things you know you won't enjoy.

 

The grabbing hands grab all they can, everything counts in large amounts.

BQ

I guess I see your point(s) sorta..  so it really is just a numbers game for some folks then?  and yeah, the same person (who must live pretty close by) went and waymarked every mc'd's along with several subway's, real estate offices, and other junk in my area - so what do you win for having the most waymarks?  (asked rhetorically and with a touch of sarcasm)

true, I've seen some geocaches that make me scratch my head, but it seems the system here encourages junk entries (they're much easier then submitting a geocache even) so people can bulk up their count.. not something I noticed with gc's

are the waymark entries reviewed at least and require approval as they do with gc's?

and I still think it's a bad first experience for someone coming to this site to see a bunch of retail locations and will turn off more people then it will attract..

but thanks for the explanations..  I'll try filtering out the junk and see what shows up..  I do love the old school virtual's

Look at it this way; with geocaching, you may not know until you get there that it's an Altoids tin in an office park, but with waymarking, you know it's a McDonalds that you don't want to see.

I have been much happier waymarking with the liberal use of the "ignore" button.  But I still try to do one waymark in each category before hitting that button.  First of all, yes, I do play "waymarking bingo" and want to collect the icons.  Secondly, it allows me to see waymarking through the eyes of the people who do enjoy the category.

My example is "bicycle tenders".  I voted against the category, and I thought, "Oh, I'll do one and get it out of the way."  I ended up posting WM4FN6, which isn't the world's greatest waymark, but it made me think, "If I were riding my bike around here, I'd find this to be helpful information about what a bike-friendly place this is."

And the people who proposed that category probably waymark a bunch of stuff I *do* like to see, so it's a way of returning the favor.  (Before I hit the ignore button...)

robdogg:

I guess I see your point(s) sorta..  so it really is just a numbers game for some folks then?  and yeah, the same person (who must live pretty close by) went and waymarked every mc'd's along with several subway's, real estate offices, and other junk in my area - so what do you win for having the most waymarks?  (asked rhetorically and with a touch of sarcasm)

Don't equate high numbers of waymarks to doing chains etc.  I have a fairly high number of waymarks and very few commercial waymarks.  Yes the commercial ones are easy but my enjoyment does not come with high numbers, it comes from doing enjoyable waymarks for me which are usually are  historic, architectural/engineering or art related.

robdogg:

are the waymark entries reviewed at least and require approval as they do with gc's?

Yes waymarks are approved by the group who manages the category in which the waymark is listed, thus the McDonalds are reviewed by the McDonalds group and the National Register of Historic Places waymarks are reviewed by the National Register of Historic Places group.

robdogg:

and I still think it's a bad first experience for someone coming to this site to see a bunch of retail locations and will turn off more people then it will attract..
 

I agree if all I saw was listings of places I didn't want to visit I could become discouraged but look at it from the other side it just means there are lots of opportunities for you to showcase those interesting things in your area by submitting waymarks.  I think you will be able to find categories to showcase most intersting things in your area.  Just think if there are 20 commercial waymarks there now and they are the only ones what will it look like if you have 200 interesting ones on top of the 20 you don't like... they just won't seem so bad.

Uh.  Yeah, Bruce, you have a "fairly high" number of waymarks alright.

BruceS:

robdogg:

and I still think it's a bad first experience for someone coming to this site to see a bunch of retail locations and will turn off more people then it will attract..
 

I agree if all I saw was listings of places I didn't want to visit I could become discouraged but look at it from the other side it just means there are lots of opportunities for you to showcase those interesting things in your area by submitting waymarks.  I think you will be able to find categories to showcase most intersting things in your area.  Just think if there are 20 commercial waymarks there now and they are the only ones what will it look like if you have 200 interesting ones on top of the 20 you don't like... they just won't seem so bad.

Yes, that is certainly true.  While you might not enjoy the currently available Waymarks, there must be things around you that you think people should see instead.

Consider what you like, what catches your eye everytime you pass by it, what the tourists go to see when they are around, and see if it fits into a category.  I bet anything that you come up with will fit into at least one if not several.  Which by the way we encourage as well, cross listing.  Unlike geocaching, you can created multiple waymarks for the same location or item in many categories.

BQ

Hi, Robdogg,

Thanks for asking your questions politely.  So often we get, "This is stupid, why do you do this, kthxbye" type posts.

The great thing about this site is that it's so versatile.  It's a highly customizable scavenger hunt, a database of useful locations, a great slide show of a lot of weird and interesting things, and even an encyclopedia. 

I don't plan to waymark a McDonald's -- I have the entire Chain Restaurant super-category on my ignore list -- but I'll certainly download coordiantes for them next time I'm on a trip.  It's much easier than going to the corporate site and finding locations via whatever crummy map they use.

I generally avoid the commercial categories, but I have participated in the Natural Food Stores category because it's useful to me (allergic kids).  So it's a category I'd like to see fleshed out as much as possible.  For the same reason, I submitted a gluten-free bakery to the Independant Bakeries category.

Someone else mentioned Bike Tenders.  I, too, originally thought it was lame but possibly useful.  However, cities are putting out some interesting bike racks these days.  Those, I think are very cool, and I like browsing the pictures in that category (not a lot yet).  After thinking I'd never participate in that category, today I submitted one, because I came across one designed to look like a martini glass.

What do you win?  Well, there *are* ribbon icons that light up in your profile.  And when you get to 5000 -- check out BruceS' avatar.  That's what he won.  (I don't know if everyone gets one of those or just the first person).