Groundspeak Portal

I think I read someone mention something about these in another thread, but could very well be wrong. Either way, what is everyone's thoughts of waymarking USPS Blue Boxes? (If anyone can think of another title, please let me know)

Some things I have thought about:
1) Yes, I know USPS and not global. I don't know what other nations do, and I think it would be better to have those waymarked separately, much like historical markers.
2) If a single location contains more than one blue box, it would count as only one waymark. I was thinking a variable like "Number of Boxes at Location:" would cover those sites that have 2, 3 or more.
3) Blue boxes at USPS locations (the buildings, which already have a category) would be included, even though the USPS station is possibly already waymarked.

It was tried once and it bombed in peer review.

Do you happen to know why?

Too many of them.

I guess I can see that. I'll have to do a little digging on numbers and history to see if I could overcome that.

I figure it's useful, and, just like payphones, they're disappearing thanks to e-mail.

This topic kind of cross lists with Post offices as well as every post office has a blue box, while there are blue boxes elsewhere, about half your waymarks for this category are already covered. Personally,  I don't think it is all that interesting, I'd rather you have a waymark category for non-standard USPS boxes. (I saw SteveHerrick put up a R2D2 USPS box once which I thought was cool in the star wars category).

rmikelyons:

Do you happen to know why?

Not interesting.  Too boring.  Too many.

I've pulled my hair out trying to make post office boxes seem interesting when they were no longer post office boxes and failed to the point where that's on the back backburner. In the absense of "wow", function has to be obvious. I can't imagine in service post office boxes dazzling anyone.

But with that said, payphones aren't too interesting, either... and there's a number of categories that any one of us can yawn at.

How's about post boxes that aren't on post office property? I really think that's what R. Mike is suggesting is getting rarer and rarer to find. There's always going to be post boxes in front of the post office. But the ones placed around town might be becoming less common. The town where I live is 50 years old this year and there's not a single post box located beyond the post office, but we're projected to have over 200,000 residents by the end of 2009 (and have plenty more room to grow).

Redneck Parrotheads:

But with that said, payphones aren't too interesting, either... and there's a number of categories that any one of us can yawn at.

Just because there are other boring categories does not mean that a trend should be started. (If I remember right payphones might have been started before peer review)

I think that the thing payphones has going for it is that they are dying at a far more rapid rate than blue boxes ever would (unless the post office went away). I don't particularly mind payphones, no they aren't exciting, but they are becoming more and more rare every year thanks to the cell phone. While I personally would like something more intriguing, I do think there is a place on waymarking.com for rarities.

If you tried to take blueboxes off of the post offices, I'd still be torn. I do think they are becoming more and more attached to post offices than they used to be, but I don't think they are that uncommon. You'd also need to specify how far away from post offices it needs to be. I know of one particular post office box that's about a block away from a post office on a more main road for the convenience of drivers. Yet I would still consider this a post office blue box and I could totally see this type of thing going through because well it isn't right next to the post office.

BruceS:

Redneck Parrotheads:

But with that said, payphones aren't too interesting, either... and there's a number of categories that any one of us can yawn at.

Just because there are other boring categories does not mean that a trend should be started. (If I remember right payphones might have been started before peer review)

I think trying to establish what is and is not "too boring" is a trend that should not be continued.

Frankly, I'd like to see the waymarking list for people who write "too boring" in Peer Review comments just to see how many Taco Bells they've posted.

That aside, I think there's a slippery slope of subjectivity that isn't permitted in voting when we judge based on personal opinion rather than upholding the criteria. If we restrict post boxes to those over 500 ft from the postal center, the question isn't, "Is this too boring for me personally?" but rather, "Are there enough of them globally if they're limited to USPS and are there too many globally if other countries' posts are included?"

I wouldn't want to help manage such a category since, according to Peer Review, I have my boring quota with all the church cats, the outdoor altars, the religious statues, the pet stores, the butcher shops, the game, the john doe headstones, and the omnivorous trees (whoever said boring to all that must be a party animal!). Oh, that reminds me, birdwatching locations and alpaca & llama farms are also boring.

Redneck Parrotheads:

BruceS:

Redneck Parrotheads:

But with that said, payphones aren't too interesting, either... and there's a number of categories that any one of us can yawn at.

Just because there are other boring categories does not mean that a trend should be started. (If I remember right payphones might have been started before peer review)

I think trying to establish what is and is not "too boring" is a trend that should not be continued.

Frankly, I'd like to see the waymarking list for people who write "too boring" in Peer Review comments just to see how many Taco Bells they've posted.

That aside, I think there's a slippery slope of subjectivity that isn't permitted in voting when we judge based on personal opinion rather than upholding the criteria. If we restrict post boxes to those over 500 ft from the postal center, the question isn't, "Is this too boring for me personally?" but rather, "Are there enough of them globally if they're limited to USPS and are there too many globally if other countries' posts are included?"

I wouldn't want to help manage such a category since, according to Peer Review, I have my boring quota with all the church cats, the outdoor altars, the religious statues, the pet stores, the butcher shops, the game, the john doe headstones, and the omnivorous trees (whoever said boring to all that must be a party animal!). Oh, that reminds me, birdwatching locations and alpaca & llama farms are also boring.

One of the criteria for voting is "Interesting"  and what the person is saying when they say "Too Boring' is that it lacks interest.  They are to think in terms of what would interest waymarking community as a whole rather than individually but I can only assume when they did this they came to the conclusion it was still lacking interest.

BTW I have one Taco Bell.  (I don't say "Too Boring" when I vote)

"Interesting" may be one of the criteria, but I tend to be rather liberal in my view of what may or may not be of interest. I also refuse to deny myself the option to experience something new because of choosing to pre-judge it.

Part of my life is recorded in the Waymarks I make and visit, my list reflects what I've noticed in the world and what I've enjoyed. I'm not here to tell anyone that their baby is ugly, and there are some ugly babies out there, but I will point out when I feel a category is being created that seems to be for the sole purpose of having a category.

If I were to invoke a "fun" clause, then I would still have most of the same categories that there are now. I can have a lot of fun at a "Taco Bell", but not at a "Payphone" or a "United States Post Box"

BQ

BruceS:

One of the criteria for voting is "Interesting"  and what the person is saying when they say "Too Boring' is that it lacks interest.  They are to think in terms of what would interest waymarking community as a whole rather than individually but I can only assume when they did this they came to the conclusion it was still lacking interest.

BTW I have one Taco Bell.  (I don't say "Too Boring" when I vote)

That must be a pretty special Taco Bell!

And there are people who say "too boring" when they vote. This isn't about how you vote.

When someone says, "I don't like this," I don't think they're considering Waymarking as a game. I think they're voting according to their preference. I would like to be optimistic that every voter does adhere to the criteria but terms like "boring" and "prevalent" and "not prevalent enough" are used to such an extent, and often in such contradiction, that they lose meaning. If I see those comments in Peer Review, I toss it out because it doesn't tell me anything. Even when these terms are used in the forum by respectable people who always consider Waymarking as a game before their personal preferences, I don't understand where "boring" suddenly means "lack of interest" when the category has function. Interest can fluctuate.

How many people are really interested in zinc headstones? Ask anyone who's waymarked one (who isn't me) if they'd happily engage in or start a conversation about headstones made out of zinc. Until mtekk77 brought up Butcher Shops, I hadn't thought about them in the slightest but it's pretty interesting to think about these butcher shops and the people who make them their business. Things become interesting. We've talked about Payphones and how there's really only one payphone that I'm interested in waymarking and, really, if it weren't for the category, I wouldn't have considered it.

Can a post box ever in a million years be an interesting thing? Depends on where it is and what's going on.

But since I'm going to lose this argument and derailing with Peer Review whinging won't stop that from happening, the category can be narrowed to only consider Artistic in-service post boxes... like R2D2. I'm sure there's more out there. There's something along this vein that could work if it was written right.

I guess all waymark categories don't need to be interesting. In my mind, I break the waymarks out into different types, mostly interesting and inventory.

For the inventory, I ask myself is there is a value to having a complete inventory of all (...). I can usually find a good reason to have a complete inventory of an uninteresting thing.

The interesting and inventory aren't mutually exclusive.

I can see the utility of being able to look up my nearest USPS post box.

But I do think they're too prevalent for waymarking.com.

Alright, I just kind of skimmed through the other replies.

Boring - Sure, it's boring, but there a ton of "boring" categories out there. You have a point, BruceS, when you say that just because we have some doesn't mean we need more.

Prevalence - I agree with many of the comments about post office locations having post office boxes. After some thought, I think those should be exluded as it kind of goes without saying that post offices will have the blue boxes. The other part of the prevalence issue is that there are so many. While this is true, I think again to the payphones. At every 7-11 I can think of in town here, there are two payphones right outside. Should each one count as it's own waymark? As far as I can tell, the category will allow it (based on the cat description). In the USPS blue boxes cat I have in mind, a grouping of two or three boxes would count simply as one waymark.

To sum up my arguments:

Global - No, but there is no need for it to be. I believe that this would work best in a framework similar to historical markers where each region (post service area) would get its own category.

Prevalence - I believe by excluding post offices and having groups of boxes count as one waymark, the number will be greatly diminished.

Interesting or Informative - I will not debate whether or not it is interesting. I think we can all agree that this is a downright boring category, with the occasional interesting waymark. That being said, however, it is an extremely useful category, such as payphones. Variables would include things of use to visitors, such as pickup times.

Redundant - Hardly. Since post office locations would not be included, no cross posting would occur there. There would be a few cross posts from other categories (such as All Things Star Wars), but those are going to be rare.

Redneck Parrotheads:

the category can be narrowed to only consider Artistic in-service post boxes... like R2D2. I'm sure there's more out there. There's something along this vein that could work if it was written right.

I believe by doing that you'll lose the usefulness of the category. Also, the only really unique ones I have seen are the R2-D2 boxes, and there are several already waymarked in All Things Star Wars. There could be other unique ones, but I'm not aware of any.

It is important to note though...

PAYPHONES must accept incoming calls to be accepted. Here in Ontario, none do. I don't know if this is a state-by-state thing but maybe that was to make it more challenging. Or maybe the category was created to demonstrate that not everything needs to be "wow'ish".

BQ

0ccam:

I can see the utility of being able to look up my nearest USPS post box.

But I do think they're too prevalent for waymarking.com.

The USPS has a very good utility for this and it is complete and up to date.  Box Locator

I think there are too many of these to make this a good category.

the blue quasar:

It is important to note though... PAYPHONES must accept incoming calls to be accepted. Here in Ontario, none do. I don't know if this is a state-by-state thing but maybe that was to make it more challenging. Or maybe the category was created to demonstrate that not everything needs to be "wow'ish". BQ

As I recall the last time the blue boxes was tried one of the promoters used the concept of a finder service.  Doesn't have the wow factor, but still makes sense in my mind for waymarking.  For mailboxes, though, at least in the US, there is already a service that works better than waymarking would ever do.  I'm not fond of the payphone category, but I do recognize that it does enable people to search out a payphone.  (Although, anyone likely to be able to look it up on-line, probably doesn't need a payphone.)

I don't understand the "must accept incoming calls" thing.  A local travel agency puts a lot of the Red British Telephone boxes up around our area.  I wanted to waymark them under the payphone category, but I can't seem to find the number to call to see if they accept incoming calls.  Of course, now I can waymark them under the British telephone box category, I just haven't gotten out there to do them, yet.

steveherrick:

I don't understand the "must accept incoming calls" thing.  A local travel agency puts a lot of the Red British Telephone boxes up around our area.  I wanted to waymark them under the payphone category, but I can't seem to find the number to call to see if they accept incoming calls.  Of course, now I can waymark them under the British telephone box category, I just haven't gotten out there to do them, yet.

Call your cell from one.  Then, return the call.  :)

2600 Magazine [used to] publish the numbers for payphones.  Maybe they do that online now.

Bruce = The USPS has a very good utility for this and it is complete and up to date.  Box Locator

SWEET!!! Thank you Bruce. I've always wondered if there was a listing for Blue Boxes, I just never got around to googling it.

To me, waymarking blue boxes is a BAD idea for the PR of the game. It would be yet another category to be mocked by outsiders. Other than the cataloging of these (which has already been done by USPS), why else would someone want to create a WM or visit it?  I have yet to hear a compelling reason for it to pass peer review.

Just my 2cents

Although I like the idea, I figure if it can't really can't gain acceptance here (or at least is met with this much hesitation), then it won't pass peer review.

Maybe at a later date this could work, when blue boxes really start to disappear.

Thanks everyone for their comments.