Groundspeak Portal

I've been thinking for a while about a category for marking Zinc headstones, also known as "White Bronze."  These headstones are relatively unique in that they provided a low cost alternative to the more common marble, and granite headstones.  Over the years the Zinc headstones have proven to weather better, and they commonly appear to be new as compared to their stone counterparts. 

There aren't a lot of them out there since the company that made them only produced them from the 1870's until about 1912.  I guess the majority of people at the time felt that since they were so inexpensive that it wouldn't be a proper way to honor their loved ones.

One problem with the category as I see it is its lack of world wide revalance.  From the little information that I've found on these headstones they can be found in all 50 US states, and in Canada, but I've never found mention of them being in any countries overseas, or in Central or South America.

Any thoughts on this?  Would you find this interesting and be willing to Waymark these?  Any ideas for improvement?

I know I've left this a little vague, as I've not gone very far toward actual category proposal in my thoughts.  I figured I'd come here for a little assistance.


Here's a little more historical information I've found out there....

http://www.gravestonestudies.org/faq.htm#White%20Bronze%20Markers

From http://www.vintageviews.org/vv-tl/pages/Cem_Monuments.htm
"There are many monuments in Mt. Hope that appear to be made of a bluish gray stone. These monuments are actually made of molded metal! The material was called White Bronze to make it more appealing to customers, but it is actually pure zinc. Left exposed to the elements the monuments rapidly form a tough and very durable skin of zinc carbonate that protects the underlying metal. The zinc carbonate is what gives the monuments their characteristic bluish gray color. The monuments were erected in cemeteries across the entire United States (including Hawaii) and Canada.

These monuments were ordered from a sales agent with a catalog, and were very inexpensive. The price range for these monuments was from about $6 for a single cast tablet, to as much as $5,000.  The White Bronze markers copyied the same shapes and styles as marble and granite monuments, but the stone monument dealers seldom sold the metal monuments. The back of the catalog featured an ad asking people to become sales agents with  "No capital investment needed."

The catalogs listed the various shapes, symbols, sculptures, and panels that could be used. The customer would decide on the overall design he wanted, and then pick out the various symbols, and other decorative elements required. Price was based on the over all monument, not the number of images. Customers often ordered several images for each side. The individual pieces were then molded in zinc, and then simply bolted together with screws with decorated heads. Any text required was easily molded in the same fashion. When other family members died at a later date, old decorative panels could be easily removed and replaced with new castings with the updated information.

M.A. Richardson and C.J. Willard perfected the method of casting in 1873, but they did not have the capital that was required for full scale manufacturing, so they sold out to W.W. Evans. Evans also failed to get anything started, and sold the process to the Wilson, Parsons & Company of Bridgeport Connecticut in 1874.

The Monumental Bronze Company made the monuments from untill 1914 when the he government took over the plant for the manufacturing of munitions during World War I. In the post war years the demand for the monuments had faded, so the company turned to making castings for automobiles and radios until it closed in 1939.

Monumental Bronze opened it's first  subsidiary  in  Detroit in 1881. Detroit Bronze operated until 1885. Two more subsidiaries opened in 1886. American Bronze operated in Chicago for twenty-three years, until it closed in 1909. Western White Bronze Company in Des Moines operated for twenty-two years, and closed in 1908. These subsidiaries did not do castings, they were only involved in the final assembly of the pieces . All the original casting took place in Bridgeport Connecticut.

It possiable to find dates of death from both before and after Monumental Bronze made the monuments. The company would produce panels for family members who had died before the monument was ordered, and they continued to make individual panels after they stopped production of complete monuments in 1914.

Wax models were created by an artist, who worked at the plant. His models were then used to create plaster molds  for creating the individual pieces. The company used a patented process for fusing the larger pieces together. Zinc was heated to temperatures way above it's melting point, then poured into the joints between individual pieces. This caused the adjoining surfaces to melt together, welding them into a single unit, a much stronger process than soldering.

The company used a patented process for fusing the larger pieces together. Zinc was heated to temperatures way above it's melting point, then poured into the joints between individual pieces. This caused the adjoining surfaces to melt together, welding them into a single unit, a much stronger process than soldering.

The zinc carbonate that gives the monuments their characteristic bluish gray color also creates a hard protective skin so that the castings are still extremely sharp and clear. However, zinc has two unfortunate characteristics. It is quite brittle and may break if hit by a falling branch, and over many years it's unsupported weight will creep and sag, causing some of the larger monuments to bow or crack. Another problem, but one that affects all cemetery monuments, is poor foundations. Crumbling bases, and shifting soil has caused many monuments to lean.

The general rarity of these monuments is due to the fact that they were only produced for 40 years. This short production was caused by the fact that the metal monuments were never accepted by the public. Some cemeteries passed regulations that prohibited the use of metal markers, but it was mostly because people did not fully accept the claims that these monuments were superior to stone. Interesting enough time has shown that these inexpensive zinc monuments have remained in excellent condition for over a century, with details as fresh and cripp as the day they were cast. "


Thanks!

I'll bite.  Dou you have any photos of one?

cmelton14:

I'll bite.  Dou you have any photos of one?

Here is one I have submitted for a Medal of Honor recipient who happened to have a "white bronze" headstone

This one would not qualify for the category because it is not a gravestone, it is a Civil War Memorial however it is made of zinc.

I'd be interested in helping out if you put a category together.

That's all I need  - - another reason to go poking around old cemeteries!!

Anyway, the potential problems I see with this are:

(1). Identifying and verifying that a given headstone is zinc.  I don't think I can identify one in order to waymark it, and if someone submitted a waymark, how could we verify that it qualifies and is, in fact, zinc?

(2). This seems like a rather random criterion for grouping something for a category.  They have nothing intrinsic in common, just the material used for construction.  I'm not sure this is enough, or interesting enough, for a unifying theme in these case.

Just some thoughts . . .

silverquill:

(1). Identifying and verifying that a given headstone is zinc.  I don't think I can identify one in order to waymark it, and if someone submitted a waymark, how could we verify that it qualifies and is, in fact, zinc?

(2). This seems like a rather random criterion for grouping something for a category.  They have nothing intrinsic in common, just the material used for construction.  I'm not sure this is enough, or interesting enough, for a unifying theme in these case.

 

Good points in both, and exactly why I was looking for opinions.  As for the first point, the ones that I've seen are easily recognized by their bluish color, and the fact that they are always cast.  As compared to a stone marker they're not engraved, but rather the lettering is raised.  I didn't think ahead though, and it is entirely possible that markers in other areas would appear differently from what I've seen.  It certainly wouldn't be advisable, but since they're hollow, another way to tell would be to tap on it, I suppose, to see if it's hollow.  I wouldn't want folks running around knocking on all the headstones they find just to see if it's waymarkable, obviously.  Aside from the military plaques that are either set into the back of a headstone, or placed flush with the ground, I've never run across a marker that appeared to be made of a different metal, and I'm not aware of any that were mass produced in say cast aluminum or anything that would make identifying them either to Waymark, or approve in a category, too difficult.

For the second piece I guess where I was going with it, is the idea that they are unified by material of construction.  Being that there was only one manufacturer of these headstones, and they turned out to be relatively unpopular, they are somewhat rare.  Here in Central Ohio (and maybe down in your neck of the woods, SQ, but I can't speak from personal experience) though they do seem to be somewhat common, I can only assume this is because the manufacturer was never more than a state or two away even though it moved around a few times.

Don't take that the wrong way, I'm not trying to dismiss your remarks or anything, as they're vaild concerns, and something I would need to consider.  Additionally, your first remark points to another issue in that a lot of folks don't like visiting cemeteries, especially for the purpose of Waymarking or Geocaching, which is certainly understandable.

Taking SQ's points into consideration, does anyone (SQ included, of course) have any ideas on how to make it more workable?

Sort of off topic....the pictures that have been posted above are good examples of how these look.  I do have several other pictures that I can get posted tonight if I have an opportunity, for those who are curious.

Thanks for the good discussion -- just exactly what this forum is for!!

Okay, if I accept the premise that these are interesting enough as a group, then I think we have to rely on the description and photo to detemine that it is zinc.  Maybe a variable asking if the magnet test was performed.  I think a variable as to the date of death would be in order.  Actually I think full name and dates should be required.  The date would narrow it done.

I do think that because of their unique nature, these indeed might be interesting.  Like I said, all I need is another reason to poke around old cemeteries!  And there seems to be a little one on every hill in southern Ohio and northern Kentucky!   New England has more cemeteries than villages, I think!

Once I read about these a few months ago, I have found they are fairly easy to pick out in the cemetery.  As you can see in the pictures I posted they have a very distictive blue-grey color, the lettering is often the most readable of the "stones" in the cemetery.  Often they will have more lettering than similar sized real stones will have.  (I think already spent too much time in cemeteries )

silverquill:

Thanks for the good discussion -- just exactly what this forum is for!!

Guess I'm just still too used to the GC.com forums where lots of threads easily derail into petty arguments. 

As for the variables, I do agree at the very least I would look for dates.  I would likely require date of death, and make optional date of birth and full name.  The only reason that I hesitate to require full name is that I think it would be likely that folks would include that description, and making it a requirement would double up on the information needlessly.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of them down there in southern OH/northern KY...at least judging how many there are around here.

As promised, here are a few more pics.  The bottom four pictures are all of the same marker, just varying angles and closeness.  Most of them don't do a very good job of illustrating the color of these markers, but you can see how the lettering is raised, rather than engraved.



This one was a little unusual to me, as most that I've found are more obelisk, or "tower like" in design.




This is the same marker as above, just a different angle.


The design of the White Bronze markers was such that the marker itself was a standard design, and there were several to choose from.  The only real "customization" for the lesser priced monuments was the addition of these plates which would include names, DOB, DOD, etc. which were screwed on.  About half of the markers I've found are missing at least one of these plates.


Of the photos I could find quickly (I know I have more floating around somewhere on my harddrive, or a memory card) this best represents the coloring of these markers, but it's still not that great in this photo.  In my personal experience they have always been a bluish, or gunmetal gray color.

mr. 0:

I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of them down there in southern OH/northern KY...at least judging how many there are around here.

As promised, here are a few more pics.  The bottom four pictures are all of the same marker, just varying angles and closeness.  Most of them don't do a very good job of illustrating the color of these markers, but you can see how the lettering is raised, rather than engraved.

Was up in Circleville today and looked around the large St. Joseph's Cemetery and didn't spot any.  Maybe I didn't look hard enough.  I'll keep on the lookout down here.  I'm warming up to the idea!

I figure that I'll go ahead and throw a group together, and see where this goes.  I've been quiet here since I  wanted to give the thread a little time to see if any more opinions came up.  cmelton14, keep watching the groups, and I'll shoot you an email when I finally get it up.

Anyhow, I've always had some sort of odd writer's block when it comes to coming up with creative titles.  Any input on a group name?

Oh, I don't know.    How about "The Casket Crew"  or "The Headstone Hierarchy"

cmelton14:

Oh, I don't know.    How about "The Casket Crew"  or "The Headstone Hierarchy"

Or . .  Zinc Zombies
          Zinc Zoo

silverquill:

cmelton14:

Oh, I don't know.    How about "The Casket Crew"  or "The Headstone Hierarchy"

Or . .  Zinc Zombies
          Zinc Zoo

 

Zinc Inc. ?

Zinc Inc. -  I like that one.

I too like Zinc Inc., great suggestion.  Later this evening, if I have time, I'll work on getting the group setup.

Send me an invite - I'll join.

I first saw one of those down in Wheelersburg OH on a cache a couple years ago.. Thought they were the neatest thing.

Will do.  I haven't setup the group yet, since I haven't really had time.  I may be able to do it tonight, it just depends on what time get out of class this evening.

The group is up, and invites have been sent.  I've got three folks in there, including myself, and figured I'd add another...anyone else interested?

mr. 0:

The group is up, and invites have been sent.  I've got three folks in there, including myself, and figured I'd add another...anyone else interested?

Sure - unless you already have too many Ohio boys in it . . .
Still haven't found any, but maybe I'm still missing them.  Spend a little time driving around Portsmouth's big cemetery.  If CrystalSound says he saw some in Wheelersburg, I'll take a look.  Will be out of town for a couple days, though.

silverquill:

mr. 0:

The group is up, and invites have been sent.  I've got three folks in there, including myself, and figured I'd add another...anyone else interested?

Sure - unless you already have too many Ohio boys in it . . .
Still haven't found any, but maybe I'm still missing them.  Spend a little time driving around Portsmouth's big cemetery.  If CrystalSound says he saw some in Wheelersburg, I'll take a look.  Will be out of town for a couple days, though.

 

Yeah, what is up with Ohio and Waymarking?   It seems like 1/2 the people on here are from either Ohio or Washington...    At least I know where to go if I want to load up on visits.

I will join up also.

On the Ohio thing.... you might also be able to find a few waymarks in the Buffalo to Toronto area to visit... and there might be a couple waymarks in St. Louis to visit too

BruceS:

I will join up also.

On the Ohio thing.... you might also be able to find a few waymarks in the Buffalo to Toronto area to visit... and there might be a couple waymarks in St. Louis to visit too

Yeah, just what I was thinking!  Maybe Lincoln, and let's not forget Texas -- or Sao Paulo!  I mean if you want to rack up waymark visit numbers, go to Galveston . . . must be 100+ within a mile radius.  And, I've done a few in New Hampshire.

Actually, I didn't post my first Ohio waymark until the other day. . .

It'd be nice to see a scatter map of the U.S. (and world) to see where the hot spots actually are!

silverquill:

BruceS:

I will join up also.

On the Ohio thing.... you might also be able to find a few waymarks in the Buffalo to Toronto area to visit... and there might be a couple waymarks in St. Louis to visit too

Yeah, just what I was thinking!  Maybe Lincoln, and let's not forget Texas -- or Sao Paulo!  I mean if you want to rack up waymark visit numbers, go to Galveston . . . must be 100+ within a mile radius.  And, I've done a few in New Hampshire.

Actually, I didn't post my first Ohio waymark until the other day. . .

It'd be nice to see a scatter map of the U.S. (and world) to see where the hot spots actually are!

I'll have to admit, there are a LOT of Texas historical markers in Galveston. Plus several waymarks from other categories thrown in for good measure.