Groundspeak Portal

I just noticed that someone has proposed "burger king restaurants" as a category.   Honestly, don't people understand that waymarking is about finding things that are cool, unusual, neat, unexpected?  McDonalds, Subways, and now Burger Kings are nothing of the sort.  It's bad enough that the category list includes the first two, but can't we at least draw the line here and stop?  What's next?  Wendys? Jack in the box?  Every chain restaurant that exists?   What's the point?  Gag me already!  No!  No No No, a thousand time NO! 

WalruZ:

I just noticed that someone has proposed "burger king restaurants" as a category.   Honestly, don't people understand that waymarking is about finding things that are cool, unusual, neat, unexpected?  McDonalds, Subways, and now Burger Kings are nothing of the sort.  It's bad enough that the category list includes the first two, but can't we at least draw the line here and stop?  What's next?  Wendys? Jack in the box?  Every chain restaurant that exists?   What's the point?  Gag me already!  No!  No No No, a thousand time NO! 

I could not agree more. If I want to find one of them I don't need coordinates, I can usually find one within minutes of looking.

Ah gee ....
 I was just going to propose  Home Depot,  Ace Hardware, Kentucky Fried Chicken, Wendy's,  Taco Bell,  Hardee's, Jack in the Box,  Long John Silver  and lets not forget the re-born A&W  Restaurants -----

There are benefits to providing this kinds of listings.  Here is what appeals to me about it.

I find out if there is a drive through or not.  Maybe the listing gives details about the quality of the location, or if parking is a nightmare.  Maybe it will attract me to a certain Geocache if I need food and/or drink.  Maybe the rest of the family would join me knowing they can go shopping before or after my GPS gaming.

I see these as a chance for people to review the location, and that might either encourage me to visit for a reason I wasn't aware of, or just get the visit in passing.

Every listing that I provide in these types of Categories, I try to let people know what to expect and how the location appears to me. 

Maybe when you are in town, they aren't exactly useful.  But when I go to another town, they are VERY useful for me.

I also have sent links to Tim Horton's or Subway restaurants that I have WM'd as a point of meeting with other Geocachers.  Instead of having to type out a long winded (yeah, I know... like I don't anyways) email about where to meet, I send a link and at 9am.

There are topics that don't interest me either.  But please don't censor other people's interests or requirements.

In reality is a Fire House any more useful to a Waymarker than a Home Depot?  Or an Airport more useful than a Dairy Queen?  I'm more likely to "need" a Dairy Queen in my travels.

BQ

the blue quasar:

There are benefits to providing this kinds of listings.  Here is what appeals to me about it.

I see these as a chance for people to review the location, and that might either encourage me to visit for a reason I wasn't aware of, or just get the visit in passing.

Every listing that I provide in these types of Categories, I try to let people know what to expect and how the location appears to me. 

I already know what to expect from a McDonalds and a Burger King.  I expect what they sell at their thousands of other locations.

the blue quasar:

Maybe when you are in town, they aren't exactly useful.  But when I go to another town, they are VERY useful for me.

As a person that travels extensively and have yet to find a need of a waymark to find a one of these francises.  Get on any main street and I will find one within a few blocks.

I don't view it as censorship.  It is just that not everything needs to be a waymark. Common place places are not really interesting.  From the  waymarking  home page "Waymarking.com provides tools for you to catalog, mark­ and visit unique and interesting locations around the world."

I usually don't view categories by their usefulness but more for uniqueness of content. (There are exceptions like wireless and libraries).  I have listed several fire stations, some very mundane but several very interesting architecturally.

All I am saying is that to 'black list' concepts like franchise stores is unjust.

The comment that some fire stations are architecturally interesting can apply to all buildings regardless of their current use.

One person might think that Historic Plaques are already well documented in various government publications.  Does that mean we shouldn't have them?

All of us can go through the Directory and make statements like "Why do I need to know where is a pay phone - airport - thrift store - cemetery - brewpub - ice rink - benchmark - penny press - armory... shall I go on?

When I go to New York, which is only 20 minutes away, you can be sure I will be loading the location of EVERY Tim Horton's into my GPS/PDA so that I can rely on my friend "Rayman" to get me (or more importantly my wife) to a coffee.  I don't know the streets there, but thanks to Rayman I can find them.

How would this discussion look in Geocaching?  "I don't want people to list micros anymore"... right.. good luck.

BQ

the blue quasar:

When I go to New York, which is only 20 minutes away, you can be sure I will be loading the location of EVERY Tim Horton's into my GPS/PDA so that I can rely on my friend "Rayman" to get me (or more importantly my wife) to a coffee.  I don't know the streets there, but thanks to Rayman I can find them.

Every Timmy's? I better get to work then, I'm still missing a couple dozen over here.

I have the same feeling as BQ. Numerous times when I'm up caching in Ontario looking for his great caches, I've wanted to find a Tim Hortons. But not being familiar with the area I drove around aimlessly for 15-30 minutes looking for one not too long ago. Now that he's waymarked a significant amount, I'll be better off than before.

I go back and forth on this issue.  While I may (or may not) agree with you that franchises make boring categories, is there a real reason not to have them?  Does it detract from waymarking as a whole?  There are many obscure categories (in my view) and others that I may find mundane or otherwise dislike on whatever grounds, they are still significant to other people.  Hey, did you ever look at the

Most franchise chain categories are mundane, and useful only as a tool to locate them.  That may not be exactly what Waymarking was intended to be, but the coordinates of places you rely on are nice to have.  When on foot, staying at a hotel, it would be quite convenient to have the coordinates to the closest Walgreens.  In the backwoods of Texas or Pennsylvania, where coffee shops are a rarity, it is useful to have the coordinates to the closest Starbucks.  Even in New Orleans (to escape the weak coffee of PJ's) those coordinates would have been useful to me and would have saved a lot of driving. Everyone has specific, mundane, everyday places that they find extremely useful, for some its Walmart, others it's the local library or the free wifi spot, others it's the closest McDonalds with a Redbox.  Who is to determine which categories of a practical value are worthwhile and which aren't?

Jake39:

Ah gee ....
 I was just going to propose  Home Depot,  Ace Hardware, Kentucky Fried Chicken, Wendy's,  Taco Bell,  Hardee's, Jack in the Box,  Long John Silver  and lets not forget the re-born A&W  Restaurants -----

Hard to find a good root beer float these days.

I'm torn on this one.  I think they can exist, and people can do them if they're interested.  I already ignore categories I don't like--that way they don't bother me, but those that enjoy them can still participate.

  

Hard to find a good root beer float these days  

Brings back memories of my 'earlier' cruising years. Burger 25cents and a root beer about the same price..  and those roller skating girls

WalruZ:

I just noticed that someone has proposed "burger king restaurants" as a category.   Honestly, don't people understand that waymarking is about finding things that are cool, unusual, neat, unexpected?  McDonalds, Subways, and now Burger Kings are nothing of the sort.  It's bad enough that the category list includes the first two, but can't we at least draw the line here and stop?  What's next?  Wendys? Jack in the box?  Every chain restaurant that exists?   What's the point?  Gag me already!  No!  No No No, a thousand time NO! 

Amen, brother!!   I also don't get the point.  Want to find a McDonalds?  Pull off of the freeway and there it is - right next to the Walmart and Burger King.  Or better yet, pull up the phonebook on the internet.  For me waymarking is about finding the unique, stand out places.  You know, like the little deli that uses brick oven baked bread for their sandwiches and micro-roasted beans for their coffee.  THOSE are the kind of places that are impossible to find when you don't know an area - not  franchise stores. 

At the same time, I'm sure that some people find some of my favorite categories boring.  Would it be possible to create a Franchise section of the website? (entertainment, franchises, history/culture...)  That would keep them on the site, but stop them from clogging up the other areas. 

Just an idea.

hikenutty:

That would keep them on the site, but stop them from clogging up the other areas.

There's already a function to do that.  Use this button on the category page ->

I already use this for a category or two in my area that I'm not interested in--it's like they were never there in the first place.

I think that chain restraunts should stop. I personaly think that mcdonalds and burger king are disgusting so i will defintly vote neah

YUM

Yes, the ignore function is very useful and efficient.  I tend to have more of a "Laissez faire" attitude toward category creation.  Persons caching or waymarking in a new location may appreciate being able to locate one of these establishments quickly.

I have geocached for a couple of years under fantastic_4 then changed to talesfromthesurface last January. I have to say I miss listing some of the virtuals on the Main Site so I thought I would stop by here to check it out.

I found a list of mostly fast food restaurants, post offices, and fire stations near my home coords. I have seen these places all my life, where is the wow factor?

This is a turn off compared to some of the virtuals that could be found on the Main Site.

Could I list some? Oh yeah I could, but I wouldn't have anything to find but fries and shakes.

I think I will wait awhile and see if this gets straightened out before investing any time at the drive-thru.

 

Gone Geocaching!

talesfromthesurface  Understand your disappointment .but for know the fun is in creating the waymarks (Both what once were  Locationless & Virtuals)  Find a category that interests you and then waymark it .  Eventually the game will transform into a finders game but for now it is mainly in the creation.  Take my Category Picture Perfect Postcards.  You could find a postcard then the challenge is to take a photo of the place and create a waymark for it.  There are many many interesting Categories but it takes time before it will turn into a game to visit others waymarks.  So my advice is pick a category you like and challenge yorself to go out and discover them in your area and create waymarks.

{"Honestly, don't people understand that waymarking is about finding things that are cool, unusual, neat, unexpected?"} Here we have someone who must have a grasp on something that the rest of us don't.  I am amazed at the alooffness of that statement.  The implication is that the author's narrow definition of  what Waymarking is, and what it's purpose should be is the same to all who "understand" it.

Should it be usefull? should it be artfull? yada yada.  It ain't none of my business what it "should" be.  It is what it is to you and it is what it is to me, and the elitist might be dumbfounded to learn that the two  may never be the same...but now we are to be told what to "understand"?

To waymark Burger King or to not, that is the question.  I think the catagory would be fun to somebody.  Why would I value my opinion so highly that I would stop others from having their fun?  I don't give a hoot about pennysmashers, graves, things antarctica, man-hole-covers, or a spot where someone last saw the passing of fire engine 69 from the NYFD.  But then again, somebody does, and THAT'S cool enough for me to say "Go for it Ya'll...have fun and get everything you want out of the sport!!"  People who want to come in and unilaterally define this sport for everyone else bore me to tears! The last wide open frontier of geocaching left and someone wants to Nazi-fy "taste".

No, there probably won't be a Burger King catagory...not as long as some of us feel we need to tell other people how they can, and can not have their fun.  Rules are to keep people from getting stepped on...not to use to step on others...now THAT'S what everyone needs to understand. And for those who would have this website take on a "Country Club" mentality..... just because you don't have an interest in something it doesn't mean you're getting stepped on.

zoid sedit 

Ya know, Geocaching started out as this great idea to see 'unique & interesting sights & places' also, but I sure as heck dont find lamp post skirt caches in the middle of any urban parking lot very interesting, or even some cache deep in the middle of blah noscenic view woods very exiciting either.

But would I think to even suggest to another cacher that they can go find or hide them? Hell no I wouldnt.

To each there own, you dont like a catergory then skip it or ignore it. I dont like BurgerGarbage food but that wouldnt stop me from giving it a yea vote. Someone else must have liked it to suggest it.

Let others waymark/geocache how they like to best, (general) you go do what you like best.

DiS02:

But would I think to even suggest to another cacher that they can go find or hide them? Hell no I wouldnt.

To each there own, you dont like a catergory then skip it or ignore it. I dont like BurgerGarbage food but that wouldnt stop me from giving it a yea vote. Someone else must have liked it to suggest it.

Let others waymark/geocache how they like to best, (general) you go do what you like best.

If this is the case then why have peer review.  If every category is to get a yea vote just because someone thought it was a good idea then there is no need for peer review at all. 

"Standout - Does the category arouse your curiosity? Can you imagine yourself sifting through the gallery for interesting and entertaining images, or potentially visiting one of the waymarks in person? If not, this category might not be a good fit." 

When I review categories I assume that I am being asked if it is something that I personally can imagine searching out and visiting, not whether I can imagine that other people would search it out.  If there are enough people personally interested in the category then it should be on the site.  If not, then it shouldn't.  The problem is that it sounds like most people vote on whether they think there are other people who would enjoy the category.  There is always someone out there who will find something interesting.  That doesn't mean it should be on the site.  I guess I see peer review as a simple democratic vote - do you or don't you think this category fits the guidelines given.  Am I just not getting this?  I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who will let me know.

The whole idea of peer review is great.  It sounds like it needs some kind of clarification, though.  If I'm supposed to be voting on whether I think other people would like to visit a certain category's waymarks, I'd like to know - I would be abstaining from voting on a few categories rather than voting no.

I think the point of peer review is that this is a community decision.  In the case of fast food restaurants, the opinion is mixed.  Let democracy work itself out in this case.  If the overwhelming sentiment is to approve, so be it.  If the catgegory gets voted down, life goes on.

There are lots of categories on the WM site that I have no interest in...I ignore them, either with the button that the site provides, or by not checking out those categories...

There are lots of books in my local library that I don't like, won't read, find boring...I currently have no plans to ask the library to get rid of those books...

NFA

nfa:

There are lots of books in my local library that I don't like, won't read, find boring...I currently have no plans to ask the library to get rid of those books...

NFA

 

Yet lots of peolple do ask (and hollar and protest and burn...)